I Want to Believe

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Posts by I Want to Believe

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  45

  New to the forums.

  by ViridianSoul in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i looked all over for a place to introduce myself and either i'm completely blind or i missed it.

  i figured i'd just post it here.. okay.. hello to everyone.

  my name's tabitha.

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  I Want to Believe

  Welcome! You got off a lot easier than many of us, but those lingering issues can sure be pesky. I hope you find what you're looking for here.
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  31

  Should you ever tell tour aging parents the truth about the truth

  by Star tiger in

  1. forum
  2. announcements

  since finding out the truth about the truth myself and having successfully extricated myself and my parents about the jw's, i find myself with a new dilema that being they still believe the bible as a literal book for their salvation as i has read all of thomas paines works and how the bible is not very good for the human family, as they are of advancing years would it be inappropriate to shatter their illusions of some kind of paradise and let them flounder in a moral precipice and wonder what their lives have been about.

  on the flip side once their time has come how would i feel for not telling them their false views.

  at the moment i am in the deist point of view, with a tendency of the agnostic, it is quite a dilema!.

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  I Want to Believe

  The movie "The Invention of Lying," while not a great film, did have a few interesting ideas. It presented an extremely atheistic point of view, but still put forth the notion that "lying" in regards to end-of-life matters was a positive thing, a comfort to help everyone deal with the fear of death. What would it accomplish to take that comfort away? They probably wouldn't just accept it anyway, and all you'd do is strain your relationship.
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  754

  Theists, why does God allow suffering..

  by The Quiet One in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  ..specifically, the suffering of animals.

  you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.

  i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.

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  I Want to Believe

  "If the natural world displays god's "invisible qualities" what does it tell us about god?"

  That Earth was designed as His personal Thunderdome.
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  32

  The tower of Babel- full of holes?

  by highdose in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was thinking the other day about the tower of babel ( like you do) somthing that always puzzled me about reading the account in our modern day times is that we have today buildings that would have been vastly taller than the tower of babel.

  even if purely because the materials needed to build modern sky scrapers have to be light in order to acheive that height.

  accient heavy bricks just wouldn't have done it.. just why was god so threatened by a building???

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  I Want to Believe

  "if God's right of sovereignty is to be justifiably answered man must be left alone and he CANNOT intervene, however he did, thus altering the unified message of the Bible."

  This is true since the beginning, God "stacking the deck" in His favor -- why else curse the ground so that mankind has to spend so much effort just to get food? Why confuse their languages because they were capable of doing anything they set their mind too, just 200 years into a new civilization? Why say the end is coming (according to JWs) any day now, when humanity is progressively advancing faster than ever?
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  20

  I don't like "taking the lead"

  by I Want to Believe in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  some men probably got off on the power/ego trip being a male jw gets you, but i never cared for it.

  i'm an introvert, and was an especially awkward one at that haveing been reaised in social isolation, so it was about the strangest feeling in the world when as a newly-baptized teenager (back in the day) i started to pioneer.

  i was about as green as you could get in every way but i was told i had to take the lead in the service meetings and the car group.

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  I Want to Believe

  Some men probably got off on the power/ego trip being a male JW gets you, but I never cared for it. I'm an introvert, and was an especially awkward one at that haveing been reaised in social isolation, so it was about the strangest feeling in the world when as a newly-baptized teenager (back in the day) I started to pioneer. I was about as green as you could get in every way but I was told I had to take the lead in the service meetings and the car group. So here I was, stammering my way through it for the first couple of months while lifelong pioneer sisters and elders' wives practiced their patience. I tried to get out of it a few times and, true story, one of the sisters (unprepared for such an event) had to pull a napkin out of her purse to put on her head in order to help me out ('cause nothing says respect for Divine Authority like wearing a napkin). Out in car groups, pioneers would hand me their territory cards and ask "How do you want to do this?" I had no idea, it was their territory! Then there were those who would just lay out everything we should do but then add, looking at me, "Does that sound good?" It was very odd, like I'd been put in charge of a company after applying for the mailroom.

  Recently, I told my wife that I'd rather be her partner than her head and she didn't seem to know how to take it.
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  20

  Tolerance

  by Chariklo in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  in another thread, someone wrote, about another religion,.

  actually i don t care about this religion.

  i just don t want it my country.

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  I Want to Believe

  Well, this is a board dedicated to breaking free from a restrictive religion. I'm no expert, but from what I've heard of Islamic law, even the gentle type, it ia a very restrictive set of rules that come from a dubious "theocratic" source. And there are plenty of wise and gentle JWs, but nobody really wants them around here either.
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  754

  Theists, why does God allow suffering..

  by The Quiet One in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  ..specifically, the suffering of animals.

  you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.

  i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.

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  I Want to Believe

  @Tater-T: yeah, there's a scripture that not a sparrow falls to the ground without Him knowing... which means He see the millions upon millions of acts of violence and death in the animal kingdom every day, far more than all the human suffering. But if He actually cared about animals, He wouldn't have designed them to be eaten -- the entire concept of a food chain shows He doesn't give a [crap] what happens to animals. I mean, after having the animals saved in the Ark the first thing He said was kill some as sacrifice and start eating the rest. They weren't created in His image, so why should He care?
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  7

  I need help "de-converting" my Dad! My Dad's Story....

  by garbonzo in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi guys, i saw this thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/209643/1/de-conversion-where-are-you.

  i've experienced them all and now i'm at 7).

  when i was at a 6) i didn't care and figured my dad would be happier believing in something false anyway, but i asked him if he would rather know the truth about something or not even if it will cost you saddness and he said he would rather the truth.

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  I Want to Believe

  The trouble is that the triggers are different for everyone. What got me were doctrinal/logical issues, but those do nothing at all for my wife, who never "got" those in the first place. The only things that bother her at all are the child abuse issues, bloodguilt from Malawi/changing blood issues and things like that. And things like the UN NGO issue didn't really affect either of us.

  So I agree with Ding, what he values most determines what will affect his outlook on the Society, though you still have to be subtle. And certainly don't attack the Bible, especially since you can use a plain reading of it (as other threads have shown) to refute the WTS's often convoluted explainations that result from trying to tie everything together to their particular point of view (whatever that happens to be at the time).
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  47

  New here...need some support

  by Freeof1914 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  first of all i am happy to be here..this site has been an invaluable tool which helped me get to the point where i am today.

  i was born and raised as a jehovah's witness and i am now 30 yrs old.

  my entire family are die hard witnesses; pioneers, elders, bethel etc.

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  I Want to Believe

  I am currently going through the same thing. First off, please don't rush--I know the feeling of freedom once you awaken can be intoxicating; I'm a 36-year-old born in and felt the exact same way and know the self-destructive arguments you might be facing: I only got married to avoid fornacation it wasn't true love, I've never been with another woman so how do I know she's the one, our life together was based on a lie, she's still in and we'll just grow apart anyway, etc. etc.

  LIke I said, I just wanted to ditch it all and start fresh, but my reasoning (and my own moral sense) is starting to come back to me. It's not much different than any other mid-life crisis, in that the feelings are prompted by wasted opportunites and wanting to play catch-up and live to the full. But destroying your relationship (hopefully there was some love) isn't going to solve your feelings and it will only validate your family's belief in the sterotypical apostate who abandons all moral standards upon leaving.

  Even if you think she's deep in the org, your staying with her gives you a chance to "win her without a word" through your conduct :P

  Others on this board gave me the same advice: take things slow, there's no need to rush into another life-altering decision. So what I'm doing is starting small on personal improvements: Taking a night class, learning martial arts, reading self-help books, getting to know myself. If my wife comes around and accepts the new me and what our life will be, great. If she doesn't, than at least I tried. To do anything less would be extremely selfish (at least to me; but I'm not judging your situation)
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  4

  An open apology

  by I Want to Believe in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  no real need for anyone to respond; i just have to put this out there.

  it's kind of a step in my recovery.. .

  i have to say i'm sorry to anyone i've hurt in my life because of my upbringing.

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  I Want to Believe

  No real need for anyone to respond; I just have to put this out there. It's kind of a step in my recovery.

  I have to say I'm sorry to anyone I've hurt in my life because of my upbringing. I'm sorry, Robert, Steven, Bertie, Betty, Judy, and any other family members I have had to shun over the years, or simply kept at arm's length to avoid treating like family.

  I'm sorry Ivan, Angie, Joe, Jessica, Hannah and everyone else who's ever repeatedly extended friendship to me only to have me coldly decline because you were a bad influence.

  I'm sorry Kendra and any others I treated with disrespect for my former beliefs.

  I'm sorry Christina, Joanna, Daniel, and any others I may have pushed toward the organization.

  I'm sorry Ilsa, Jim, Stephen (Jeannie?) and all the rest who faded before me. I wish I would've noticed. I wish I would've known.

  And a final apology to all my friends and aquaintences who are still in: I'm sorry I can't come back, and I'm sorry I can't get you out. I can only hope that some of you find your way out into true freedom at some point. I'll be here waiting and watching for you.